Business is not a Zero Sum Game with Jay Levy

Gut Instincts & Helping Underdogs Win

Jay Levy founder of Zelkova Ventures shares valuable business ownership lessons as he talks about some things he has learned on his leadership journey.

On today’s episode, I talk with Jay Levy about gut instincts, going from zero to one hundred and how he loves to help underdogs win. 

[00:00:00] Julie Bee – Host: On today’s episode, I talk with Jay Levy about gut instincts. Going from zero to one and how he loves to help the underdogs win. I’m Julie B and they don’t teach this. In business school, 

[00:00:14] Midroll Spot: every business owner needs a support network. When asked, most business owners will reference their support network as what gets them through the tough times.

There are three characteristics to consider when documenting who is in your support network. And Julie has a free guide to help walk you through each of them. Download your free copy now@mejulieb.com. 

[00:00:36] Julie Bee – Host: Hey there, I’m Julie B and you’re listening to, they Don’t Teach This In Business School, a podcast where we discuss business ownership lessons that are learned through experience, not in a classroom or seminar.

On today’s show, I am interviewing founder and partner of Zelkova Ventures j Levy. Some of his investments have included Clout, superhuman Reportive, health [00:01:00] Scout and Alloy. That is quite a portfolio of investments and those are mostly software companies and I know that we are just gonna have a great conversation today and really learn some lessons from him about, from his own leadership journey.

So Jay, welcome to the show. I’m so glad to have you here and thanks for being on the Being on the show today. 

[00:01:20] Jay Levy – Guest: Thanks for having me. Looking forward to a, a great conversation. Yeah. 

[00:01:23] Julie Bee – Host: Jay, why don’t we just start it off with you telling us about your business and what your role is in the business. 

[00:01:30] Jay Levy – Guest: So I am the co-founder and managing partner at Zco Ventures.

We’re an early stage software fund, so we, we started about 15 years ago and we saw a need about 15 years ago in New York for early stage money. What we had seen was, The venture funds that were in New York at the time were applying the same rigor to a $500,000 check as they would apply to a 5 million investment.

And companies at different stages have different needs and different availability of diligence materials and different KPIs and and results. [00:02:00] So we saw real opportunities. So now, 15 years later, we’re now actually based in Miami and we focus on early stage B2B software companies. So I really like to invest.

And work with companies that help companies do business better. So think about tools for small, mid-size enterprise companies that can help them sell more, reduce expense, be more efficient, market better, communicate better, do things better for their customers and ultimately their business. We’ve invested in over a hundred companies.

We technically invest early and follow on. So we wanna be part of the first or second round of funding. A lot of our companies will go through different incubator incubator programs. Mm-hmm. Um, which we work closely with, and we tend to be with the companies for the life of them. So we’ve got some companies that are 13, 14 years old.

Wow. But 

[00:02:49] Julie Bee – Host: still, and that’s really, that’s not what you typically think of when you think of investors or venture capitalists or, you know, even, you know, early stage. Funding [00:03:00] because usually they’re all about like making the fastest return on investment as, as quickly as possible. And then they, you know, get in and get out.

And the fact that you, you stick with your companies for that long, that’s, that’s really, that’s a different model than I’m used to hearing about for sure. 

[00:03:16] Jay Levy – Guest: Yeah, I’m looking for the right cause. I’m looking at a, a text I sent to a friend last night where I said, everything happens overnight, but no one forgets.

Everyone forgets about all the sleepless nights for the years ahead of it. So, so this just takes time, right? Mm-hmm. The, we read about and hear about. Uh, the kind of overnight success, but that’s the anomaly, right? Mm-hmm. That’s the thing that gets the headlines and gets the interest. Mm-hmm. But building companies is difficult.

It, it’s, it’s an emotional rollercoaster. There’s ups and just downs. There’s gonna be good, good days, great days, and horrible days, and it’s about learning how to manage those days and keep focus, especially for a startup. 

[00:03:53] Julie Bee – Host: Yeah. So Jay, what is your favorite part of being a business owner? What, what [00:04:00] just lights you up in the morning and, and your favorite part of, of doing the work that you do?

[00:04:05] Jay Levy – Guest: Yeah, so I like to build, like even as a kid, I love playing with Legos and a rector sets, and I think that’s really still part of my d So for me, it’s the excitement of being able to work with great people on great ideas that excite me. I’m very fortunate that. I can pick and choose who I typically work with mm-hmm.

And the ideas and the business they’re building. So it, it’s the idea of getting something from zero to one that really gets me going. It’s getting excited once, to be honest, once companies are fully scaled, fully operational, to me it’s a little less interesting then when it is, it’s really like how, how do you build from this like fragile idea into something big?

But I’m super fortunate, you know? I mean, other things you know great about being an entrepreneur and, and a business owner is you get some flexibility, right? Like, you, you, you, life is an a whiteboard. You, you’re, you are. [00:05:00] The sole person who can, needs to take responsibility for your success and your failure.

Mm-hmm. Right? If you’re, if you’re the head, the head person in the company, it’s on you to, to, to really drive the bus and to navigate the bus, but really surround yourself with great people. And that’s incredibly underestimated, I think, is the value of people to, to a lot of businesses. Yeah. 

[00:05:21] Julie Bee – Host: So how do you, how do you surround yourself with great people?

Like, uh, you know, staffing is so hard right now, and I, a lot of my own friends, and even in my own world, people are resigning for one reason or another. And, you know, how do you make sure that you surround yourself with, with great people and, and, and honestly keep that, you know, keep that talent full, open and, and flowing, right?

[00:05:46] Jay Levy – Guest: So there’s way. Few parts to you, unpack that. Mm-hmm. It’s one is how do you bring ’em on? Right. How, how do, how do you hire and, and how do you partner? I, I think being a founder, being a ceo, being a business owner, you know, you, you need some charisma, [00:06:00] right? You need to attract talent. I hate to say it, you need to be popular.

Yeah. In some respects, right? Like, you’ve gotta attract these people. And part of it is, is like, can you sell them on your vision? Do you believe on your vision, believe in your vision, does that come across and not just your pitch? Hypothetically, if you’re looking for investors or lenders mm-hmm. But employees.

Right. And if it’s not, you know, taking a step back to really understand why it’s not right. Mm-hmm. What’s interesting is we don’t ask for feedback enough. As people, right? So I think really learning and evolving and iterating your messaging. You know, recruiting is not something I love doing by any means.

And so what do I do is I surround myself with people who like to recruit. Mm-hmm. Right? Who can help me in the process, right? Whereas there are other people who love recruiting. Great. Go for it. So I think identify. Your skillset, right? And bringing people around you and having a compelling message and vision and opportunity, right?

Like that’s [00:07:00] a big thing. You know, I hear founders say to us all the time, I wish so and so had the dedication that I have, or I wish they had the. Working 90 hour weeks. There’s a whole nother discussion that I have and, and these are founders that may own 50, 60, 70, 80% of their company still, and they’re talking about employees that might own one quarter of 1%.

I said, if you want them to have the same passion, the same drive, the same focus that you do, give ’em 80% of the company, right? Like you gotta realize like you are incented cuz this is your baby. Right? And that’s the other big thing. That I think is critically important, showing your passion for the business and bringing people on that have passion for the mission.

Once you have passion, it’ll no longer feel like a job or a chore. Mm-hmm. Um, because you’ll see the bigger purpose. And that then I think, translates into how do you keep, show ’em the passion. Right. Show ’em that they’re valued, show them that there’s a future, that there’s excitement, that it’s not [00:08:00] getting stale.

A and people are gonna stick around. I, I think it’s getting very hard in this remote environment. Uh, to me to, to keep employees. Unfortunately, and I’m not, I’ll say it, I’m not a fan of the remote environment for early stage companies. Mm-hmm. Uh, you know, you used to be able to tell when an employee was about to leave, they’d come into the office maybe dressed a little bit differently.

Hey, got a haircut. You know, all of a sudden they’re taking an hour and a half lunch. She, you could, there were telltale signs. It’s. Nearly impossible over zoom in this remote environment. I also think, you know, the water cooler conversation builds camaraderie, bonds, right? Mm-hmm. I’ve always, you know, I’ve always heard people tend to leave bosses, not companies.

Well, it’s the bosses and the people are now distributed. What’s the glue? It’s holding people together. It’s become financial only. You know, when I was. Younger and was at Morgan Stanley. We, we used to go for drinks every Thursday night with my team members. [00:09:00] That really, when, when I ultimately left Morgan, it was a very difficult decision because of the people I was working with.

So I think we need to really understand the pros and the cons of this remote environment and the impact it’s gonna have on hiring, growing, 

[00:09:14] Julie Bee – Host: and scaling. Absolutely. That’s, that’s really well put. I think the remote environment, it’s just changed. It’s changed the game for so many businesses because it’s so hard to.

It, it’s really hard to kind of get a feel for what’s going on with your, in your staff’s life. If you’re not seeing them every single day or most days of the week. If you’re not, at least seeing them even one day a week would be probably better than, than all virtual. So I totally hear that. 

[00:09:42] Jay Levy – Guest: So if I could tell one story on that, we have a company in, in the portfolio that we’ve invested in probably 10, 11 years ago.

Mm-hmm. And so way before the pandemic, way before remote was very, In Vogue and the founder there decided a decade ago to embrace remote, and [00:10:00] it was a little bit of an uphill battle because the jury was still out as it still is, and the company’s been incredibly successful. But he will tell you that the remote.

Aspect of the business has cost them more money than having office space will, has caused him more aina. But they pulled it off and, and, and on the economic side is, you know, his view is twice a year, every employee has to get together in one place for two weeks. Think about the cost associated that, he’s like, yeah, it’d be much cheaper to take an office in New York or Florida or Boston, wherever it might be.

And he’s like, it’s stressful. Cause he’s also. On a plane. Mm-hmm. Nonstop. Cause he wants to go meeting with the employees, you know? Hi. His rationale for it was he felt he could hire better than the market he was in, which was probably correct. Mm-hmm. But it was not the cheaper, easier route by any means.

And I think founders need to accept that. Remote can succeed, but it takes more work than getting everyone into a conference room together in the same [00:11:00] office. 

[00:11:00] Julie Bee – Host: Every decision, every decision you make as a business owner has a plus and a minus every single one. I feel like even even the decisions that seem like no brainer, home run decisions, There’s a cost to to the even those, which I think is, you know, really that’s a, that’s a good illustration in terms of the, the world in which we work.

[00:11:19] Midroll Spot: Every week, Julie sends out big ideas and easy actions that help elevate your business. She also shares some awesomeness happening in the business community. Make sure to subscribe to the Be Awesome brief@bjulieb.com. 

[00:11:36] Julie Bee – Host: Hey, this is Julie B and you’re listening to, they don’t teach this in business. Cool.

I’m here today with Jay leaving. We’re just talking about business ownership and lessons we’ve learned. And Jay, I wanna switch gears here a little bit and ask you about your biggest wins as a business owner. Can you share some of those? 

[00:11:56] Jay Levy – Guest: Ultimately, I’m not gonna buy, you know, it’s financial, [00:12:00] right? Mm-hmm.

We invest in companies to, to generate returns for ourselves and our investors, right? So we’ve had over 30 successful exits that range from two to three times our money to over 99 times our money. So there’s been some big ones in there. Mm-hmm. You know, for us, if, if we kind of. Take away. Okay. Like, don’t just view success as financial success, but what are the other areas that I am proud of our success mm-hmm.

Is, is when we really have invested in founders who may have been viewed as the underdogs, may have been viewed as not being the right fit. Mm-hmm. Uh, and they’ve succeeded, you know? For me, entrepreneurism is in my dna. I grew up around it. I grew up around the small business, the underdog, so that’s what we invest in.

So, The other part of success, not just the 99 times our money. And, you know, the financial award is when we are investing in businesses to help other businesses make money, right? Mm-hmm. [00:13:00] I mean, there’s, you know, help Scout, you had mentioned, I mean, we’ve got tens of thousands of small to mid-size businesses, um, that use us every day to service their customers.

I mean, talk about the network effects of a business like that and, and we’re helping people all across the world. Do business better, you know, other companies, market news, a great example. Mm-hmm. Content marketing platform that helps companies market online, write better content. Obviously that’s really hot right now with everything going on with chat G p T.

Oh yeah. And, and the latest news on ai. But giving businesses the ability to, to help them, help employ, uh, help put food on the table. So, mm-hmm. We’ve got the success of the financial, but I can’t ignore the success of helping to create jobs, helping to build founders dreams and, and create wealth and freedom for our founders and their teams and, and thousands of employees across the portfolio over the years.

[00:13:56] Julie Bee – Host: Yeah, those are, and that’s a really great example of, you know, [00:14:00] having multiple definitions of success. I think that’s really important. I was, I’m teaching a class to. Brand spanking new entrepreneurs right now at a local community college. And last night we actually talked about cash flow and we, it was kind of the deep dive into financial statements for them.

And you know, of course cash is king. You know, we, that’s something, and it was very true, like you need to make sure you have access to, to cash or capital, however you get that in a, in a smart way. But I had to constantly remind them that their personal self-worth is not based on. You know how much money they have in the bank account, and that’s just a line that you have to kind of constantly navigate because other, if you, if you don’t have good boundaries around that, it’s really good to, it’s really easy to either have a really big ego or, or feel like you’re just failing because of just the nature of how cash flow is in a small business.

Yeah. 

[00:14:54] Jay Levy – Guest: I mean, we see in, in tech, in the startup world. Mm-hmm. You know, the line is everyone’s killing it and crushing [00:15:00] it. Mm-hmm. And it’s not true. Right. This stuff is hard. Most companies won’t succeed. Yeah. And even those that do succeed, the outcomes aren’t what you see in the news. Mm-hmm. It’s not the billion dollar exits, it’s the, I forget the stat though.

It was something like, of successful companies, so we’ve already taken a small pool, right? Mm-hmm. We, we know that. Unfortunately, most companies don’t succeed, but of successful companies, something like 97% had been selling for less than 50 million, which is a huge sum of money. 50 million, yeah. Mm-hmm. But in the venture world, it’s not, right?

Mm-hmm. When you’ve got companies raising 10, 20, 30, 40 million, right. And the vast majority of outcomes are less than 50, which means if you break that up, probably the last majority of outcomes are less than 20 of that set. But there is this, you know, Imposter syndrome, you can call it the, these challenges.

Mm-hmm. That that founders and business owners and Compass, because we. We don’t wanna be vulnerable. Right. We don’t [00:16:00] wanna show our hand, we don’t want to open up, especially founders that might have boards and investors mm-hmm. Because they, they fear that’s gonna lose, their investors are gonna lose confidence in them.

Their employees are gonna lose confidence in them. Mm-hmm. So we, we have a big challenge for founders and a lot of founders are, Suffer from significant anxiety, depression. Mm-hmm. Fear loneliness. Mm-hmm. That’s a big one. And we see that across our portfolio. And you know, I know I’m succeeding, kind of getting back to the defined success question.

Yeah. When I’ve got founders texting me for help at nine, 10 o’clock at night, and it’s not just about, you know, how do we hit this number? It’s. How do I help manage my employees? How do I help do this? Yeah. I’m struggling with this. When they really open up to me, that’s another way I know that we’re being successful at what we do and really being there as, as a partner and, you know, coach for our companies.

[00:16:56] Julie Bee – Host: Yeah. So kind of on the flip side of that, Jay, [00:17:00] what are some mistakes that you’ve made along the way that if, if you could go back and change ’em, maybe you would, just things that you’ve learned, some, some major lessons you’ve learned that you can share with the listeners. 

[00:17:11] Jay Levy – Guest: I’m fortunate that I get to work with people, I wanna work with, my ideas I want to work with.

Mm-hmm. Um, the mistakes I’ve made is when I didn’t go with my gut, and that’s traditionally been a, an instinct is real. Mm-hmm. Like we have to value and, and realize that there’s something to be said a about instinct and, and for me it’s been. When we’ve backed and invested in founders that I didn’t feel had a similar approach or, or moral compass as we did.

Mm-hmm. Right. By the way, some of these had financial success, right? Mm-hmm. But yet they were founders that. Maybe didn’t approach relationships, didn’t approach business with the same lens that I did. We do, and, and that’s where it’s been difficult because there’s then been [00:18:00] this tension between us and the founders.

I’m not the person who needs the final point, if you know what I mean. We, we all know those people who, who need the final dollar, who need the final point, who need to win, right? I believe in life, both parties should win. Right. And, and very few things are a zero sum game. Maybe buying a car is zero come game.

Mm-hmm. Maybe buying a house is zero come game, but most businesses not. It’s our relationship business. And in order to, to I think win in relationship businesses, everyone needs to feel like they’re winning. So for us, my failures have been, when I went against my gut and and done things that. I saw greed.

Mm-hmm. Or, or, or I, I focused on the financial success and not the bigger picture, which is challenging today. Cause you know, there are companies that. When I’ve been asked this question from our investors, you know, the answer they typically say is, well, you know, X company that we lost a half a million dollars in, or, or whatever it might be in.

When I say, no, this company that we actually succeeded in, I [00:19:00] regret doing because it was a tough relationship with the founder because we didn’t have the same moral views and, and lenses. They’re surprised to hear, but for me, we’re in such a people business, we gotta focus on that. 

[00:19:14] Julie Bee – Host: That’s a really interesting concept.

I mean, trust in your gut is, that’s something that I just, that instinct that you have no matter how it comes across, how you feel it. I, I really do think that most entrepreneurs have it, and I, I have the same experience. Any, pretty much every single mistake I’ve made or thing that I wish that I would not have done, it’s because I can look back and say, I went against my gut instinct on that.

Like I, I decided that I. Was going to go ahead and go forward with that idea or whatever it was, because, for whatever reason, but in my gut, I knew it was not the path that I should have taken. So, and, and there’s also, there’s this, I, I’ve started noticing there’s a school of thought about how there’s content out there now.

It’s like, don’t, don’t run your business based on your [00:20:00] gut instinct. And I, I personally, I think that is, I mean, no, you shouldn’t run your whole business based on gut instinct. That’s true. But, Don’t ignore it either. You know, that’s, I’m, I’m kind of shocked to kind of see that out there in the world, and I don’t, I’m a little bit concerned about it, but anyways, that’s another conversation.

Yeah. 

[00:20:19] Jay Levy – Guest: I, I think when your gut instinct goes against the data, you’ve gotta start asking questions. Hmm. Right. So, I, I think, you know, shooting from the hip, running your business completely by gut instinct, definitely not the right path. Mm-hmm. But, It should be another checkbox. Mm-hmm. Or another variable when you’re analyzing things like, why am I feeling this?

Let me unpack this. Mm-hmm. Let me figure out what it is that’s giving this added up for, for lack of better terms. When, when making those decisions. 

[00:20:49] Midroll Spot: You can have weekly leadership tips and insights delivered straight to your inbox. Sign up at b julie b dot. Come, and if you’d like to connect with Julie, she’s available on the [00:21:00] web and most social media platforms like LinkedIn, Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram.

[00:21:06] Julie Bee – Host: Hey, you’re listening to, they Don’t Teach This In Business School. I’m Julie B and I’m here today with Jay Levy, and we’re just having a great conversation about. Mistakes wins, success, failure, all of the things trust in your gut we just talked about. But Jay, you said something just a few minutes ago about how the founders of your companies will text you at, you know, nine, 10 o’clock at night for advice on things that aren’t just about, you know, making money.

And that that was a definition of success for you. You mentioned that whole lonely at the top thing, and I’m, I’m really curious because you work with a lot of founders in your business. What, what do you see? Are some things that you, your founders do or even that maybe that you do that help kind of mitigate that lonely, lonely 

[00:21:53] Jay Levy – Guest: feeling?

One of the things that I’m super big on is when we have board meetings, which we [00:22:00] do typically quarterly and check-ins in between, that is really working with the founders to ask them. You know, how are you and meaning it, right. We, we. Mm-hmm. That’s typically a throwaway question. You know, you’re walking down the street, you bump into someone, how are you?

Do we really care about the answer? Mm-hmm. And do we give a truthful answer? Typically not, right? Mm-hmm. Unfortunately, that’s just how, how the world works. Yeah. But so for us, it’s really, you know, stepping aside from the business for a second. Mm-hmm. And, and really understanding how they are and reading body language.

Yeah. Which gets so hard over zoom. Right? Like we were talking about that before. Yeah. You know, a and also me understanding my place within the company, within the founder. You know, I, I’m big about coaching. I, I think it’s, I, I actually just got back from a reboot retreat, which is the reboot organization in Jerry Clona.

They, they work with founders, they work with investors. And, you know, I, I think it’s really important to take a step back mm-hmm. And, and give yourself some space to think. Mm-hmm. Think about your business. Think [00:23:00] about who your allies are within your company and. I really work with the founders to let them answer their own questions.

I mean, that is really the core of it is unfortunately you can’t tell someone what to do and expect them to do it in anything in life. Mm-hmm. Right. Especially founders. Right. Think about like if you’re starting a business and you’re an entrepreneur, you’re going against the odds. Mm-hmm. It’s by definition, it gets a little insane.

It’s a little crazy. Just a little, yeah. Right. And now you think they’re gonna listen, like typically they don’t. But understanding that, right? Yeah. And you know, coaching is all about understanding that the person possesses the answer. How do you get them to realize the answer on their own? Yeah. So they go on the path they already know.

So we really focus on that and I highly, highly, highly recommend any founder, any ceo, any business owner who’s got employees, [00:24:00] go. Invest some time, take some classes. You don’t have to become a corporate coach. Mm-hmm. I’m not a, I’m not a coach. I’ve never taken the exams. I’ve taken a bunch of the classes, read the books, take the classes and learn, because at the end of the day, as founder, ceo, right?

Mm-hmm. You should be the coach and not the players. Yeah. Right. And you should hire players that are better than you around you, but really know how, how to work with them to make them and give them the space and the resources. Yeah. To excel. 

[00:24:34] Julie Bee – Host: I, I laugh when I think about, if I’m probably going to age myself here a little bit, but the Glen Gary, Glen Ross movie, the scene where, yep.

It’s basically sell, sell, sell, and always be closing. And I think about that in terms of always be coaching, because I feel like when you are a leader, every moment you have with your people, Is a coachable moment, you know? Now sometimes obviously work just has to [00:25:00] get done and it’s a project focused, you know, due dates, deadlines, what are, you know, all of that.

But that, that I have kind of flipped that into my brain of always be coaching and, and it sounds like you really strive to, one thing I think is important is to learn how to meet people where they are. Yep. And then walk with them, you know, so it might mean that you’re walking backwards on a path for a little bit, but you know, Finding where they are, and then just having the rest of the walk with them is really important as a, as a leader in, in that coaching capacity.

For sure. 

[00:25:34] Jay Levy – Guest: Yeah. The, uh, the visual I always get is, is the conductor of an orchestra. So you go see an orchestra and you’re like, you know, it’s, this conductor actually is, are they necessary? Yeah. Right. Mm-hmm. And, you know, I I think as a founder, you want to make, and, and a CEO and a business owner, You wanna make yourself unnecessary at some point, right?

Mm-hmm. Where you can go away for a month and the business still continues. In fact, a lot of times we [00:26:00] see when founders leave town, the business improves because yeah. The team feels like they have some ability to be more creative. They have more space, they can take risk. Mm-hmm. So I always say like, you see the conductor, they’re doing their thing, but you’re always scratching your head, are they really necessary?

And the answer is, if you ask them, they’re like probably 110%. But if you ask any of the bad members, they’re like, no, we don’t need the conductor. Like we can do this on our own. And that’s the type of employees you gotta bring in and partners and co-founders to bring to the table. 

[00:26:33] Julie Bee – Host: Yeah. So Jay, I know we talked about success a little bit earlier on, but is, is there a, is there like a one or two item checklist that you define as successful beyond money and, you know, are there, are there anything that you can look at and say, I had a successful day, I had a, I had a successful week.

Anything like that that you have in your, in your world? Yeah. [00:27:00] 

[00:27:00] Jay Levy – Guest: For me, success personally looks like when I can support our founders in, in their goals Right. And be there for them. Mm-hmm. So nothing makes me more excited. Is that as that 9:00 PM text message. Mm-hmm. Uh, I prefer a 9:00 PM text message to a 7:00 AM text message for the record.

There you go. Because I’m not a morning person. So I think for me it’s that. Mm-hmm. And then it’s when I help our companies do things that. They were having challenges with, I mean, we’ve been through a rollercoaster in the past two years mm-hmm. And we’re seeing, you know, a very difficult funding environment.

So in, in the past month now, I’ve been able to help two of our companies raise their next rounds of financing. And that’s really rewarding when one of their first investors is helping to make intros. Mm-hmm. Um, that gets them to the next level. So that’s success. You know, the things that I hate is the fact that.

99% of the time we’re saying no to companies. Yeah. Right. You know, we, we [00:28:00] see eight to 900 companies a year. We invest in seven or eight of ’em. Like that’s not fun, right? Mm-hmm. And that’s the difficult part, part of the business. The, the fun part is when we get to say yes, right? And we get to wire that money and sign those documents and have the first board meetings and, and meet with the companies and sit in product strategy, that, that’s the fun stuff.

Absolutely. The, the, the unfun stuff, unfortunately for me is the, the passing. But it’s great to see founders with, you know, vision with burn grit. I mean, grit is so important to business owners. So I, I’d say those are the two, two that are for me, success. Thanks. 

[00:28:37] Julie Bee – Host: Well, as we’re coming to the end of this conversation today, Jay, I just have one other question for you.

If you were going to teach a class about being a business owner to future entrepreneurs, what is one thing you would really want them to learn in in your class? 

[00:28:54] Jay Levy – Guest: I think a lot of, we’ve talked about it. Mm-hmm. S focus on the people, surround yourself [00:29:00] with people that have. Different, better, more experienced than you do.

Don’t be afraid of that. Too many business owners are afraid to bring on people that they, you could be replace them smarter. ’em. So focus on the people, right? Surround yourself with great people. And once you’ve done that, be a coach, right? Really invest in your people and giving them the tools to succeed.

So I, I think if I had a off the cuff title, the course, it would be, The people business. Right. Because ultimately that’s what a lot of are written. 

[00:29:36] Julie Bee – Host: Have you written a book yet? Because maybe that’s your book. 

[00:29:39] Jay Levy – Guest: I, I, I have, I, I have not. I would probably need a dozen ghost write to write a 

[00:29:43] Julie Bee – Host: book as somebody who’s going through the process and does a process.

So I’ll just say that. Leave it there. Well, Jay, listen, I have so enjoyed this conversation. I just want to thank you for being here again with me today. I know the listeners are gonna get a lot out of this interview For sure. 

[00:29:59] Jay Levy – Guest: [00:30:00] Thank you for having me and I really enjoyed it and happy to come back whenever.

[00:30:03] Julie Bee – Host: Alright, and that is a wrap on this episode, but please subscribe to this podcast on your favorite podcasting app so that you don’t miss out on future conversations. I’m Julie B and they don’t teach this in business school.